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Celestite · Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: Motivation

Hi
I would appreciate any comments on my dilemma. Are there any other teachers out there who teach but don't perform (anymore) and struggle with motivation when it comes to their own playing, and if so, what do they do about it? I am Mum to a 9 year old and a very nearly 2 year old, and whilst I am teaching still, there is next to no time left to practice myself. I find that when I do get the chance to sit and play I am frustrated by how far my technique has deteriorated and lament the fact I can no longer tackle the masterpieces I used to play with relative ease in my college days. Whilst I have no desire to go back to the recital stage I would love to find a way of getting myself going again.
At the moment I find myself avoiding the piano rather than face the issues it raises for me. Any suggestions?

Samick · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: Motivation

I know exactly how you feel.

I have only been teaching on and off for about 5 years, but already find that after I have seen the last pupil out of the door, the last thing I want to do is start practicing myself! (Funnily enough, even more so after lessons with beginners that although musically are not challenging, but mentally I find exhausting). Consequently, things that I used to play as a youngster, I certainly can't manage these days.

However, I think it is important to keep playing "something" outside of the usual teaching regime, and have been fortunate enough to pick up quite a lot of accompanying work over the years. This means that having agreed to take this on, you have to find time to practice, and it does help with the motivation. Dependent upon the type of work, it also keeps the technique going!

Have you thought about doing some accompanying? Good accompanists are extremely difficult to find, and it can be extremely rewarding working closely with another musician/singer, which seldom happens as a solo pianist. Perhaps this is something you could consider? It may just do the trick! You can even register yourself for free as an accompanist on this site, and who knows what work you might pick up.

Stuart · Regular Poster Joined: 11 Sep 2005 Posts: 20 Location: UK

I wonder what your practice aims are? Do you derive more pleasure from 'getting through' pieces or are you not happy until you have nailed all the technical difficulties?
If 'getting through', then a variety of works at a time, gradually improving, but enjoying the playing as you go, may find you gravitating to the piano more often.
If you want to get it right, then just one or two approachable pieces at a time (maybe ones you have never looked at before) might enable you to get a sense of improvement quickly.
Either way, studies at an appropriate level (you give no indication of your ability, I'm guessing Grade 8+ and that you are a 'get it right' person) will ease the pain of recovering a rusty technique. Cramer?
Whatever provides short term pleasure/satisfaction within a long term aim is the way forward and I suspect you know this already.
As someone who left the piano for the harpsichord for nearly 20 years and has spent 10 years building back (and extending) my piano technique (Rachmaninov and Rameau need radically different approaches!) I have some appreciation of where you are, but technique can return.
Hope you can find a way forward: think of the pleasures to come when the children are older.

Stuart

Gill the Piano · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:44 pm Post subject:

Why not have a lesson yourself, maybe once a month? I do, and it makes me practise; nothing worse than leaving a lesson and thinking 'I've just paid 35 quid to sight-read for an hour'!
I agree about the accompanying, it's excellent to do - but you have to brace yourself for the odd idiotic enquiry about 'accompanying my son for Grade VIII [insert name of instrument here] the day after tomorrow'! :\

Celestite · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:50 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the empathy, Samick, it's much appreciated to know I'm not the only one struggling with this! I've been teaching for over 20 years and I actually find it has the opposite effect on me in that it makes me yearn for the way I used to be able to play. Trouble is, by the time I get to put the "me" head on instead of the Mum, Teacher, Housekeeper and Wife heads, I find there's precious little brain left in it!
I have done a considerable amount of accompanying over the years and in fact, it was a recording session I did with a singer just before Christmas which brought it home to me just how far things have slid. Sure, I played the stuff as well as she would have wanted but oh, the aches and pains my poor hands went through! I think my best plan of action is going to be to make a point of setting aside even just half an hour a day to play in the hopes it will keep things ticking over until the youngest starts school, so that when I do need to up the pace for accompanying etc there's less of a mountain to climb. I think moral support from my peers would help enormously if anyone has a magic wand out there!!

Celestite · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 10:40 pm Post subject:

Stuart
Thank you for your encouragement. You read me very well! I am indeed of the "get it right" school, which is what leads to my frustration! I took perfomance as my major option when I did my BA in the early 90s and realise how unrealistic I am being expecting to be able to play like I did when I was practising 8 hours a day!
I've obviously started revisiting my technical exercise books but I take on board your suggestion re studies - can't believe it didn't occur to me, doh! Embarassed

Thank you for that! I suspect the trick is going to be to pitch new repertoire at a level which will challenge me enough that I don't stop to consider the standard I was playing at before.
As for the kids, they're a constant source of amusement and amazement so worth all the sacrifices!

Gill
I'm so glad you mentioned the occasional lesson - I've just contacted a fellow teacher in the area and explained my situation (I've immediately regretted telling him I'm a teacher - I now have to face him for the first time on Thursday wondering what on earth he's goiing to think of my playing now Rolling Eyes

) I haven't told a soul (not even my husband). It seems such a bizarre thing to do. I have to say, just knowing I've got to play to someone who won't be easily impressed has actually focused my efforts to set aside a little time to sit and tinkle the ivories. Fingers crossed (well, when I'm away from the keyboard, anyway!)

Gill the Piano · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject:

You'll be fine; he'll be impressed that you have the humility to ask about lessons - there are too many teachers who 'know it all already'! Having played for forty years now (that must be a clerical error, as I'm only 21...!) I don't think anyone ever stops learning. I think I'll have piano lessons till I drop, because otherwise I'd never do any practice! Rolling Eyes

Celestite · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject:

Thank you so much for the words of encouragement, Gill - we must come from the same era of 21 year olds!
I'm sure I've read somewhere that you're a piano tuner, haven't I? In which case I'm delighted you play as much as you do. I've got through a fair few tuners in my time and have yet to find one who actually plays more than their one stock piece to check the fruits of their labours when they finish. I've never understood why they don't play when they have such a passion for the instrument they nuture. nice piano

Gill the Piano · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:14 pm Post subject:

I still play the same ol' pieces when I finish because I don't play by ear, and so have a (tired!) medley of odds and ends of half-remembered bits!

Celestite · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:25 pm Post subject:

Ah, but at least you play for pleasure too and I'm sure your medley is infinitely better than the tuner I had who couldn't play a note but trained himself to play (sorry, bash out) the first four chords of a Chopin Prelude! Whereabouts are you based?

Celestite · Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:14 pm Post subject:

Hi Everybody
Having been so supportive in my quest for motivation, I thought I'd fill you all in now that I have actually had my first meeting with a fellow teacher.
I think the best way to describe the occasion is "surreal" ( I kid you not, I tell it the way it really happened!)
When I eventually found the place in the middle of a housing estate with no obvious pattern of house numbering (and then only by acosting two old ladies to ask for directions, which led to the obligatory half hour discussion about Aunt Maud) I was greeted by a chap much younger than I'd expected, ie, not geriatric, a damp patch on the wall in keeping with the exterior appearance of the house and a strong smell of incense. "Oh well" I thought, "I'm here now, nothing ventured....."
I then entered the living room, expecting to see a piano awaiting my attention, but nothing that predictable. Instead, there was the largest hospital type bed I have ever seen with a very old lady in it, obviously far from in the best of health. Whilst still trying to get my head round this and maintain some sort of grip on reality, I was asked to go upstairs to the first room on the left which I did with an increasing sense of trepidation. I peeped nervously round the door of the room on the left and saw a bedroom wardrobe and chest of drawers, at which point I thought "Run away". To my huge relief I then saw a desk and a piano.
By this time there was no escape so I just had to take a deep breath and hope for the best. When my teacher came in, we had the usual introductory chat and I started to relax a little as he started asking me all the questions I would have asked if the roles had been reversed. I obviously then lifted the lid of the piano to play, wondering what I would find - answer - a very out of tune, school hallish Bentley which I assume he keeps purely for teaching with his own instrument being somewhere downstairs ( didn't notice it though, probably because of the all dominating bed).
Anyway, to cut a long story short, the chap does seem to know his stuff and i have come away raring to start work on a Handel Suite, Bach Partita, Schumann Romance and revisit the Schubert F minor Fanasie duet which I last played ****years ago at college so it looks like this ultimate in bizarre arrangements is going to serve its purpose. Watch this space!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:11 pm Post subject:

I'm in Buckinghamshire...don't worry, you're quite safe out there in Essex.
Blimey, what an odd lesson. Still, a high percentage of musicians are...eccentric, shall we say. You get used to it after a while - I bet everyone on this forum could outweird your encounter...
The main thing is that you've been galvanised into action and enthused (is that the right term? I dunno, it's Friday and my brain is starting to frizzle) and you're excited about playing. Which is what you wanted - excellent!

Celestite · Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:22 pm Post subject:

Ooh yes! Indeed, we pride ourselves on what some might consider wierdness. Personally I prefer to think of it as uniqueness, but I have to say, yesterday's experience brought flashes of Psycho to mind!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject:

Just don't use the bathroom. Not if there's a shower in there... Shocked

Celestite · Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:58 pm Post subject:

I'm just so glad the old lady was in a bed, not a rocking chair!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:35 pm Post subject:

MWAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Twisted Evil

Geminoz · Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:57 am Post subject: Motivation

Having returned to the frum after an absence of quite some time (hoping those dreadful spammers have disappeared) I was delighted to find another person with such a glorious sense of humour as Gills has joined the forum.
A warm welcome from me Celestite. Very Happy

I look forward to reading more of your adventures and this will motivate me to return to the forum more often.
I do so enjoy a good chuckle Exclamation

Gill the Piano · Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:31 pm Post subject:

I MISSED you; I was going to start digging to come & see where you'd got to...

Celestite · Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:44 pm Post subject:

Good evening, Geminoz and Gill and thank you for your welcome Geminoz.

Well, call me a wimp if you like (I answer to most things as long as they don't start with "Mum, he's doing .... "or "Mummy, I got snotty nose") but I'm afraid I just couldn't bring myself to go back to the House of Psycho, if for no other reason than what to do if the old lady had disappeared - sympathy for teacher or relief for pupil. And of course, then there was the Bentley (sigh). So, not to be thwarted at the first (bed?) post, I began my quest afresh.this time with a great deal more success, even if somewhat lacking in bizarreness (?). I have found a wonderful Italian lady some 45 minutes drive away and had my first session with her this afternoon. I knew instantly we were going to see eye to eye when I discovered we're both coming from the same direction, ie, arrival of kids = disappearance of piano playing opportunities. I spent a brilliant child free hour soaking up her enthusiasm having mutually agreed to consider her my mentor rather than my teacher, since she is as keen to absorb from me as I am from her. I have to say, she insisited she was just being honest, but I do think she was being very kind in her appraisal of my playing. Anyway, to cut a long story short, I have come away enthused to start work on a Bach English Suite (2 or 3), a Scarlatti sonata and a piece by Glazunov.

I was brought very abruptly from cloud 9 back to earth when I got home to find my daughter proudly showing off her prowess at Old MacDonald on the piano to my parents whilst being watched in amusement by her little brother sitting on his potty."Ho hum" I thought, "welcome home, Mum"!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:59 pm Post subject:

I'm glad you've clicked with somebody - it's very important with a one-to-one teaching relationship.
Was little brother passing comment on sister's playing, then...?

Celestite · Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:20 pm Post subject:

Well, since she wasn't playing Tinkle Tinkle Little Star, I think the answer would have to be no! It did conjure a wonderful mental image of people in the front row staring up at the artistes on stage!

dave brum · Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 8:32 am Post subject:

If I were in your shoes, Celestite, I would look upon my piano as my escapie route, and a link between me and a kind of Nirvana. For example, I am on benefit, have two of my wife's cats depositing their hairs and vomit all over my lovely furniture, all my friends are miles and miles away, and I'm stuck here in the most miserable small minded town in the whole UK. But as long as I can sit by my piano. open the lid, and either learn to play, or play a piece, then I'm okay. Try listening to either piano or organ music while you're washing up, or doing your chores, and you might just keep that hunger for your piano that we all need.

Celestite, what a beautiful name. Bet it's really Tracey Jones or something like that, innit Very Happy

Celestite · Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:02 pm Post subject:

Hi Dave

That is exactly how I view my piano - it's what I am when I'm not Mum! The only reason I don't listen to piano music is because invariably, when I put the radio on, it's playing something I used to perform when I was at college, which only serves to highlight how far things have slid in terms of my own playing. That having been said, now that I have rekindled my passion for playing whenever I can, I have set myself targets which should mean it won't be too long before I can tackle all the greats again and listen to them with equal enthusiasm!

You can't possibly live in such a dreadful place - that honour goes to a town a few miles down the road from us (won't name it for fear of being a victim of the lynch mob which resides therein!) and I guess from yourname that you live rather more than a few miles away from us!

As for Celestite, it is taken from my other passion in life - crystals. Celestite is a stunningly beautiful blue quartz like crystal (I take it's name, not its properties!) I did suffer the surname Smith for 23 years until I banged my head against the wall hard enough one day to come to my senses and divorce him! Hubby number two gave me a much nicer, even if still ordinary name!

dave brum · Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:06 pm Post subject:

Hi Celestite, hope you're having a good day Smile

I'm sorry I haven't got around to acknowledging you sooner, but me and my piano have been a very busy little twosome all day yesterday and today. I've learned a brand new scale, that of Eb, and I've been playing some of these children's hymns and songs from a book I got about a year or so ago from a charity shop for £1. Until now I've been able to play all the songs in the keys of C, D, Bb and F major, and their relative minors, so this is groundbreaking stuff for me (and "Fiona" of course!)

I know that before too long, you will be playing confidently, and it's a cliche I know, but you have to give it time, you cannot atone for all this missed pianistic opportunity in a short space of time. But you are going about it the right way by taking lessons. Good for you, Celestite (can I call you Trace...) Laughing

You must in some way squeeze in a bit of time in order to do this, after all playing the piano is first and foremost based on enjoyment, so with your enthusiasm, all 88 of those keys belong to you.

You sound quite boho...amd my mother in law is from Essex, you know. Barking. Completely.

Enjoy life...

Celestite · Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:31 pm Post subject:

Ah, Barking, I know it well! (I actually lived in Barkingside many eons ago - I kid you not!)
In my vast experience of life and especially as a muso and a mother I have found sanity not to be all it's cracked up to be. It definitely pays to be two planks short of a full floor, imho!
Congrats on mastering Eb - I was doing battle with Db melodic minor yesterday and realising just how many years it's been since I did any serious practice. I'm glad to report the scale lost it's battle to defeat me, yay! I've been very good so far and used any pupil cancelations as extra practice time and poked my tongue out at the duster in preference for a few extra precious moments tinkling the ivories so the quest continues......
As for Trace, well, no problem as long as you don't mind answering to Sharon!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:34 pm Post subject:

Dust won't matter; I subscribe to Quentin Crisp's theory that nobody notices it after the first half-inch.
Do some scale practice for me, will you? I loathe them!
It's fine being Barking; it's when you're Upney that trouble starts... (ie one step beyond Barking...)!

Celestite · Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:51 pm Post subject:

Quentin Crisp would be proud of me - my mother once asked if I'd moved the furniture round because the place looked so different, when all I'd done was a little dusting. When I do it, the whole world notices!
When I was at college, it took two hours to practice the 144 different scales and arpeggios which were compulsory requirements and I have to say I loathed them with a passion, as you can imagine, so now, just a carefully selected few each day really doesn't seem anywhere near so arduous. In fact, they help me to switch out of "everything else" mode and into "piano" mode.
I suppose we should really be aiming at being Baching, shouldn't we? Laughing

dave brum · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:02 am Post subject:

If by chance you used to listen to Radio 4 you would be familiar with the late Linda Smith, who was actually my cousin, absolutely true Shocked

One of her famous one liners is the concept of when your mind and soul reach a point known in London Underground-speak as Upton Park, that is, being two stops short of Barking.

Which doesn't help as my good lady wife supports West Ham Smile

Promise my next comment on 'ere will be to do with pianos.

dave brum · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:11 am Post subject:

And, by the miracles of atomic science, it is.

I had a very pleasant surprise this morning. I was making my wife a cup of tea this morning when I heard a strange clicking sound coming from the back bedroom, where I have my digital piano. To my surprise, I rushed upstairs to find my wife sat at the keyboard practising C-major scales.

Hopefully this COULD be the start of something big, I'd better get to work on that arrangement of "I'm Forever Blowing Bubbles" which is something very difficult for an Aston Villa fan to do Confused

Gill the Piano · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:20 pm Post subject:

Grit yer teeth and get on with it...we could have a convert here!

Celestite · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 8:44 pm Post subject:

Absolutely-strike while the iron's hot!
When I first met my hubby he decided he would learn to play the piano, something he'd always wanted to do. All was going well until we started living together and he stopped playing because he couldn't handle the idea of practicing in front of his piano teacher Sad

I bit my tongue furiously when he was playing and didn't say a word, so as not to discourage him but he said it was no good because he knew exactly what I would be thinking so it was just as bad as saying it out loud. Hmm...not what you'd call a roaring success in terms of my inspirational effect on him!
I think I got the better end of the deal - his claim to faim is being able to convert me to the finer points of malt whisky, another of his passions!

Gill the Piano · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:25 pm Post subject:

My husband is utterly unmusical, and it's brilliant! No interference, no 'what about a little rubato there?', no bickering over whose turn it is for the piano. And he only knows when I've hit a bum note because I use words he recognises from the building site... Embarassed

Celestite · Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:41 pm Post subject:

Sounds very much like my first husband, the difference being he'd come out with little gems like "Are you sure it's supposed to sound like that?" and "Do you have to make that row?" Most constructive from someone who was completely tone deaf!

dave brum · Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 10:51 am Post subject:

After all the time I've spent cajoling my wife into taking piano lessons (better watch what I say as she's right over my shoulder!) I think I may hace finally got somewhere. Of course I do not expect either of us to be playing Symphony Hall in our lifetimes, but to share with her the joy of learning a musical instrument would be cool. I showed her the animated film "Sparky's Magic Piano" with a very blatant ulterior motive a while ago, so this may be my first chance to prove myself as a teacher (cowboy).

After all, marriage is about sharing as she has done with her (expletive) cats.

Celestite · Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:58 pm Post subject:

Absolutely! Good luck!
I'm taking a different tack with my husband. He has a lovely singing voice but is painfully shy so as soon as I can get my act together I'm going to book him some singing lessons so that we can run through some Schubert Lieder together.
Btw, I suffer his cats too!

dave brum · Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject:

Hi again Celestite, hope you're okay Smile

The tack I'm taking with Mrs. Brum is to start with her sense of rhythm as I know that is what needs working on, following the preliminary tests I've done on her. So, I've given her lots of reggae to listen to, lots of heavy steady rhythms to give her a good grounding.

Then if she's feeling a little crotchety, I'll give her a bag of Quavers, maybe. Best of luck with your hubby by the way....

Celestite · Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 1:50 pm Post subject:

Hi Dave
I'm fine,ta. Hop